Car News

Years ago I ran into similar issues trying to have discussions on
rpg.net, so stopped using the site since they flag all such topics as
against their terms of service since it gets so heated. I had half a
dozen threads closed just for trying to have civil discussion on the
ratio of male/female gamers, but it blew up because it discussed
anything to do with sex or gender.

I tried a different conversations about ages of people in groups and I
forget what killed it, but again, some how people diverted it into an
identity politics debate, rather than just trying to get some feedback
from people.

Another is related to my ongoing current research on experience of bias
and exclusion in the gaming industry and community that I have been
working on since 2013, and have a WSU IRB from the WorldCon 73 Phase 2
part of the project. Need to finish that report this summer from the
two phases (IRB expires this Auguest, else will get it extended).

All attempts to discuss the topics from this legitimate research were
shut down on rpg.net and other RPG sites, almost immediately, even
before anyone could respond.

This meant moving all such topics to the rpgresearch.com website rather
than dealing with all the PC / anti-PC battles.

-Hawke


On Wed, 4 Apr 2018 10:51:59 -0700 (PDT)
"Mike \"Talien\" Tresca" <miketresca@gmail.com> wrote:

> Here's a summary of every argument against any of the topics that
> have been raised about a diverse, welcoming group in gaming:
>
> - *"There are more important things to argue about":* That
> discussing things like nuance, representation, and how we phrase
> things is unimportant and not worthy of discussion, which has the
> chilling effect of trying to squash the discussion in the first place.
> - *"No you're the racist!": *That by bringing up the topic, you
> are anti-white people and therefore anyone bringing it up is actually
> a racist.
> - *"But what about the vikings?": *If we're concerned about how
> other cultures are portrayed, "why doesn't anyone care about the
> vikings?" -- ignoring, of course, that not all cultures are equal or
> dominant.
> - *"This isn't an issue because I game with diverse people/I'm a
> diverse gamer.": *Minimizes the discussion by using one data point to
> make an argument that since the gamer in question doesn't experience
> it, it's not an issue.
> - *"Everyone is equal, so why are you being so racist?" *Similar
> to "no you're the racist!" this argument ignores all of human history
> and argues that since everyone should be treated equally, the
> discussions are pointless.
> - *"Keep real life politics out of my fantasy!" *By being
> inclusive, you are part of the "PC police" and therefore attempting
> to control thought, or ruin everyone else's game, and the slippery
> slope of even DISCUSSING a more inclusive environment is the
> beginning of the end for all gamers and must be resisted strenuously.
>
> The moderator who runs the site has received death threats for even
> hosting the conversation. Here's a sample:
> https://twitter.com/Morrus/status/978060591658086400
>
> Both threads were closed for a combination of any of the above points.
>
>
> On Wednesday, April 4, 2018 at 1:07:00 PM UTC-4, Ted Skirvin wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I don't typically frequent Enworld. Can you give a brief rundown on
> > why the first two threads were shut down?
> >
> >
> >
> > Ted
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wednesday, April 4, 2018, 12:33:02 PM EDT, Mike "Talien" Tresca <
> > miket...@gmail.com <javascript:>> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi All,
> >
> > What does this group stand for? I'm curious as to our mission
> > statement. I went looking for it, but it looks like the existing
> > web site is down: http://www.car-pga.org
> >
> > Here's why I ask: My understanding is the CAR-PGA was dedicated to
> > positively engaging with non-gamers about gaming. Back when it was
> > formed (before my time), I believe the primary issue was the
> > Satanic Panic and overall ignorance about RPGs.
> >
> > I wish I could say those days are over, but there is now a line of
> > thinking that is aggressively divisive and reacts with unbridled
> > hostility to anyone questioning the status quo. It started with
> > Gamer Gate, but let there be no doubt that it affects every aspect
> > of gaming, including tabletop RPGs. D&D's surging popularity means
> > our biggest problem is no longer ignorance about the game, it's the
> > gaming population's own prejudices and biases.
> >
> > I think a group like the CAR-PGA should be dedicated to making
> > role-playing as welcoming as possible for everyone -- and yes, that
> > includes diverse voices and diverse topics. Are we all older white
> > guys? Has there been any effort to reach out to more diverse gaming
> > voices? How do we recruit new members?
> >
> > And relatedly, what are we doing to advance RPGs as a group? After
> > seeing Black Panther, I've been thinking about otherism, and that
> > led me to write two other articles about stereotypes that early D&D
> > reflected -- phrases like "orientalism," or lumping all African
> > nations into one fantasy region, or even whether or not we should
> > be still classifying sentient humanoids as "races" in D&D. The
> > first two threads were shut down, the most recent is still going:
> >
> > - *Do We Still Need "Race" in D&D?*
> > http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?5099-Do-We-Still-Need-Race-in-D-D
> >
> > - *Do We Still Need "Oriental Adventures"? *
> > http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?5036-Do-We-Still-Need-Oriental-Adventures
> >
> > - *When Fantasy Meets Africa:*
> > http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?5018-When-Fantasy-Meets-Africa
> >
> > I'm not sharing these threads to show my work, but rather a data
> > points about the state of the RPG audience (at least, online) today
> > as reflected in the comments. I encourage you to read as much as
> > you can tolerate. You will see some amazingly thought out, really
> > interesting points...and you may also despair for the future of our
> > hobby.
> >
> > It seems to me that this group should be the champion of this kind
> > of dialogue, even if you don't necessarily agree that things should
> > change -- we should at least be asking the questions. I have no
> > doubt you are all doing excellent work in personally advancing
> > RPGs. But as an organization, I'm concerned about this group's
> > future.
> >
> > I welcome answers from prospective board members to the above
> > questions.
> >
> > --
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> >
> >
>

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